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Post by alex on Sept 10, 2005 14:43:51 GMT -5
As an introduction to this, i want everyone to pitch in something new about Yngwie's style of music, then in a group or independantly, use what we have learnt to create a song and then maybe someone would like to record it...
Ill start off with what i know about the theory of his music.
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Post by alex on Sept 10, 2005 14:49:29 GMT -5
the 2 main parts to his style is..
* The Diminished Arpeggio
* The Augmented Second
The scales he uses are :
* The Double Harmonic (H,+2"<> in Anne's language",H,W,H,+2/<>,H)
* The Hungarian Minor (W,H,2+,H,H,2+,H)
* The Spanish Phrygian / Phrygian Dominant
* Melodic Minor
* Natural Minor
* Octatonic
plus some others but thats the core i would say..
Anyone else comment on what he uses (think of Trilogy suite)...
someone wanna describe how he uses pedal notes, chromatasism, sequence etc?
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Post by queenofshred on Sept 10, 2005 18:04:10 GMT -5
Hmmm -- you've managed to make my own language almost unrecognisable to me!
Now, the descending sequence (think Brothers). It's basically a reverse of the classic metal chord sequence VI, VII, I but with a little ornamentation to it. Or i, iv, VII, III, VI, iidim, V which repeats in a cycle. Various inversions of these chords may be used. The melody line in this sequence can quite nicely be harmonised with a similar motion line a 3rd below.
I might not have written this correctly, as it's a long time since I've used this roman numeral notation for chords, but I hope this makes sense.
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Post by queenofshred on Sept 10, 2005 18:23:30 GMT -5
The scales he uses are : * The Double Harmonic (H,+2" <> in Anne's language",H,W,H,+2/<>,H) * The Hungarian Minor (W,H,2+,H,H,2+,H) * The Spanish Phrygian / Phrygian Dominant * Melodic Minor * Natural Minor * Octatonic plus some others but thats the core i would say.. Ah! I think, If I have deciphered this language correctly, we have a different opinion or understanding of what the double harmonic and the hungarian minor are. In my notation, double harmonic ..<>..ll..<>.. hungarian minor ll..<>....<>.. they are basically the same scale but start in a different place (a bit like how the church modes are related) and to clarify, this is how my notation works for the other mentioned scales: phrygian dominant (I think it can also be called phrygian major) ..<>..ll..llll melodic minor ll..llllllll.. natural minor ll..llll..llll what is octatonic? Never heard of that one  ...and don't forget harmonic minor -- where would Yngwie be without that! ll..llll..<>.. ;D |
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Post by blackdragon480 on Sept 11, 2005 2:19:43 GMT -5
He kinda hit on the harmonic minor when he mentioned the Augmented 2nd, as that's what is found between the 6th and 7th degrees of the scale.
As for octatonic, it is usually used to refer to a diminished scale (i.e. alternating whole and half steps). While I know there is at least one more way to make an octatonic scale, diminished is the most common. Although it is something I tend to associate with Rimsky-Korsakov and Stravinsky, more so than Yngwie.
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Post by alex on Sept 11, 2005 7:40:13 GMT -5
Yeah, i think i was a bit, leaping too far to say Yngwie uses Octatonic, but the diminished scale is heard..
for Octatonic isnt about the scale really, its about the use of it..
It is the scale based on W H W H W H W H as mentioned before..
Pioneered by Stravinsky when he wrote "The Firebird Suite", Heavily influenced by Rimsky Korsakov (hate spelling that name).. and more famously in "The Rite Of Spring"
The "core" and the point of it, is its equality, its a mirror image on both sides and very easy to sequence and invert and retrograde.
Its lack of a dominant means it is impossible to function in classical music no cadence can ever played.. and it is very usually played in scalic motion or upwards even intervals to give it its sound..
Thats about all i know of the Octatonic scale..
but with Yngwie, he likes it for his diminished chords, and taking the solo to Dragonfly, there is a part and its diminished chord moved all the way down, also in Trilogy Suite, but ascending.
Yeah Hungarion minor and Double harmonic are modes of one another, like Harmonic Minor and Phrygian Dominant are.
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Post by alex on Sept 11, 2005 7:44:20 GMT -5
I dont really notice much chord progressions he uses and queenofshred, i would have never picked up on that aspect when looking at his music, so, thank you for that contribution..
I also wonder why he never goes into a key with many sharps or flats.. the only song i have seen with more than 2 sharps is FBTS, in F# minor..
i have seen him regularly use C minor aswel, but never to that F minor.
Im not really big on structues...
Does anyone want to comment on how he typically constructs his songs? is it Intro Verse Chorus Verse Chorus Solo Chorus Outro (seventh sign just popped into my head)?
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Post by queenofshred on Sept 11, 2005 9:27:16 GMT -5
that is exactly it
*thinks of stucture of most of my songs and hangs head in shame*
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Post by alex on Sept 11, 2005 9:57:21 GMT -5
To The Gallows!
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Post by queenofshred on Sept 11, 2005 14:53:25 GMT -5
I also wonder why he never goes into a key with many sharps or flats.. the only song i have seen with more than 2 sharps is FBTS, in F# minor.. i have seen him regularly use C minor aswel, but never to that F minor. But FBTS IS in F minor! Basically, Yngwie likes Eb minor and other keys that fit well with that. More detailed answer coming later... |
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Post by alex on Sept 12, 2005 11:04:13 GMT -5
the tab i have says its in F#
it starts on the 4th fret D string, which is F#...
(light bulb)..
Which on Yngwie's guitar is an F..
when it sounds better as F# minor.
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Post by queenofshred on Sept 13, 2005 14:31:51 GMT -5
I just played it in F# minor to see if it was better and I thought my violin was going to fly away! I had to stop...I need that violin! I prefer F minor, but that's because it's burned into my mind in that key, and so when I hear it, it fits and everything is good. Ah! I think I got the point of all those W and H things (whole and half tones?) and, if that's what everyone else uses, I'll try to use it, too. I just find my notation more automatic coz I see dots and lines and diamonds etc when I hear these scales. I just had a complete mind freeze when I read that the other day and thought "wtf are all these letters? That means nothing!" But now I see that it's EXACTLY the same and I was just being stupid and repeating it all again for no good reason. Yngwie's use of pedal notes? I think he explains this quite well in the Wild Stringdom lesson here: www.yngwie.org/music/images/GW1.JPG |
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Post by alex on Sept 14, 2005 10:43:27 GMT -5
its T / S or W / H
T = Tone
S = Semitone
W = Whole step
H = Half step
i cant believe you never saw that..
why was your violin gonna fly away?
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Post by queenofshred on Sept 14, 2005 11:15:35 GMT -5
Maybe I have seen it, but I never took any notice because I wrote it my own way.
You know how Red Bull gives you wings (although I personally hate it)? I think F# minor gave my violin wings!
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Post by alex on Sept 14, 2005 17:17:01 GMT -5
so according to my algebra book...
Red Bull = F#
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